Interview with Ashley Thomas, November 1, 2017

Ashley Thomas, transcript, November 1, 2017

Chelsea: Thank you for meeting with me today. Eh I was going to ask you just a few questions I have here over your perspective of leadership and kind of how you go about leadership yourself. One of the first questions I had was what is your profession? And do you have more than one job?

Ashley: I do. I technically have two jobs, um one is I'm the assistant softball coach at Belmont University and my second job is I'm also a professional softball player with the national professional fast pitch league.

Chelsea: Awesome! What is professional softball? Is it a year round profession or?

Ashley: professional softball is basically our form of major league baseball, it is on a lot smaller scale, um it is not year round, and it's for the three months of the summer. So, august until, or middle of May to the beginning, to the end of august Is when our season is. Um, there budget and there pay is a lot different in the professional softball league, so they are not able to keep us year round, cause the pay is a lot lower so they can only keep us for those three months.

Chelsea: So it's basically a summer job and doesn't really interfere with your second job

Ashley: Correct, it is um, as soon as I am done with my assistant coaching job, I go straight into my professional season.

Chelsea: What part of your personal biography or background led you to this position, or both of these positions?

Ashley: I've always been brought up to be the best at everything you do, whether its school, whether its sports, whether it's taking the trash out be the best at it. Um, so the fact that I got into softball and I really loved it and I loved learning about it, I loved the lessons it taught you as a player and also as a person. Um, I wanted to take it a little bit further and continue pass my college career, um playing professionally because that is considered the best of the best softball that you can possibly play. Um, going from there, I always, like I said I've always enjoyed learning about the sport as well, and being able to mold young minds and um young women into the people they are going to be based through softball. Um softball lessons that they learn during practice, during games, and so I continued from playing professional to help um young women be able to take this game and turn it into something that will help them later on in life in the work force, becoming strong women. Um, so I went into coaching at a university.

Chelsea: Did you ever dream, like as a kid that you would make it to that professional level, and have aspirations to do that?

Ashley: At first, when I was young, you know I just really enjoyed playing the sport, and then when I found out I was decent at it my dream was to go to college and get college paid for through playing a game that I loved. Um, that was my dream and unfortunately I didn't know that there was a professional league until, really I didn't understand the league until I got into college. Eh so halfway through college whenever one of my assistant coaches while I was playing in college, she had played professionally and she was talking about it. Um, so I decided to make that my next dream. You know I already gotten to college, I've already become a D1 athlete, and now what's the next thing that I can do to be the best at this. So I, decided that that is what I wanted to do after college is play professionally and if there was any way that I could, then that's what was going to happen.

Chelsea: And that's basically the highest level you can go correct?

Ashley: Yes, there's also um an international league for softball for fast pitch softball, but that competition internationally is not as good as what it is in the United States. Um, so professional softball bringing in all Americans from all kinds of universities, um it is considered the best of the best.

Chelsea: And I know-- time- 5:09 there bringing softball in the 2020 Olympics do you ever think about going into that to further your career

Ashley: That would be a great opportunity and hard one to turn down but considering I have my assistant coaching job, which is my livelihood and is the thing I'm learning I enjoy a lot more, I enjoy molding and creating strong women for the future a lot more so than just playing with the best athletes. My priority is my coaching job but it would be hard to turn down the opportunity to play in the Olympics because that opportunity doesn't arise often.

Chelsea: And what does leadership mean to you? Is that very important to have playing softball, as well as coaching softball.

Ashley: It's probably the most important thing, you notice as a coach when you have good leadership you have a good season, when you have bad leadership the season doesn't go as well as you want it to. Whether its seniors or juniors or a strong leader it comes natural to, natural a server that tries their best to serve the best they can, the team will have a team direction that its going in. everything falls into place for a team. As a player it's a lot easier to be on a team that has a leader. You know who has your back, things go smoother and a lot less stress. If you have that leader you know who to go to and who will help. Whenever you have strong leaders who understand their role on the team and what their there for it makes it a lot easier to play for those teammates.

Chelsea: What experiences have most shaped you as a leader, any certain experiences that stick in your mind?

Ashley: All growing up I was told I needed to speak up I was a shy kid but nobody really told me how to speak up or when to speak up. It was definitely something I had to learn. Once I got into high school I had a really good coach that understood all aspects of the game, not just physical. He understood mental and team dynamic. He's the first person who started talking to me about leadership and leadership qualities. It's not the loudest person on the field, it's not the one who takes control or playing the best. It's the one maybe isn't as loud but makes eye contact with everyone and is able to build relationships and understands that the role they have is an important one. Leaders on the team are given this gift to serve other teammates. Once I was told that it made speaking up in practice and in games, in life a lot easier for me because I understood really what leadership was.

Chelsea: What adjustments did you have to make between college softball and professional softball?

Ashley: I had to make a lot of adjustments, a lot of physical adjustments, the game in the professional league is a lot faster and had to be aware of that. As far as leadership skills I had to throw in the back of my mind and get rid of the thought that I was playing with the best players in the world. And for a while I was intimidated to speak up and tell my teammates when they needed to do things or when they were doing the right things. I had to go back to the true definition of leadership and that is knowing my role on the team and knowing I was there to empower them and encourage and help. Once I understood that I grew in my leadership. I grew a lot. Once you get into the working world and you're in an office with people who have been in the office that are really good at their jobs, sometimes that can be intimidating. So that transition I had to make from college to professional has also helped me becoming an assistant coach. Transition helped me become when becoming assistant coach I knew as a leader I'm here to lead my team and with other people in the office I knew we were here to empower each other and made the transition a little bit easier from each level that I've been at.

Chelsea: You have people who could be thirty years old in professional league correct? I could see why that could be intimidating because you might think they've been playing professional longer than me, what is my place to step up and take charge.

Ashley: That was definitely a thought that went through my mind, I'm a new player coming in and at the time I was 22 coming in and playing with 30 32 year olds and who am I to speak up to them. But if they understand that I'm here to help them as teammates and to grow them in any way I can then they are a lot more apt to take that constructive criticism and take it in a good way versus a way that comes from me being inexperience.

Chelsea: I think that's the hardest part to especially with college softball because coaches always say freshmen can be leaders but I think a lot of people get nervous about stepping up because they are so young and think people will look at them differently. You would say that you developed more leadership skills between the transition of college softball and professional softball?

Ashley: Although I was a leader on my college team from a very early point. My sophomore year I transitioned over to shortstop which is a leadership position in the infield. Kind of take control of everything and people look up to you, so early on I took on leadership roles in college. I did pretty well at it because I understood my role. But the amount of growth I had from college to professional softball was pretty amazing. It definitely has helped me throughout my other profession being an assistant coach. It has helped in so many ways, I get a lot of compliments on how I coach and I think it has to do with those experiences and growth that I had to go through.

Chelsea: How would you characterize your leadership style? You were saying there's quiet leaders, there's loud leaders but maybe there work ethic is different but how would you characterize your personal leadership style.

Ashley: I would say I am definitely still pretty quiet, I get loud and excited, very enthusiastic, but I am definitely not the loudest one on the field. I mostly lead by example by being one of the hardest workers on the team, through that you gain respect from your teammates because they know your putting in the work, and when you're putting in the work it pays off. You play well or do well. I definitely lead by example, but I also am big on creating relationships with my teammates, keeping a very open mind or understanding the personality even if I don't clique, I still try to find a few things we can relate on or talk about to build that bond between us. Its more than just on the field job, you have to put the team in your thoughts. As a coach I'm a little bit louder but I'm definitely not a yeller. I try to make my team realize the importance and the bigger picture. I also lead by example, I try to go workout in the weight room just to see that I'm working hard even though I don't have to be in there. Or playing professionally, that's also a great example for the girls. They understand that I come from a pretty amazing experience that not a lot of people get to go through. Creating relationships there I'm a very personable person, I'm not going to sit there and yell at you on the field when I haven't talked to you about your day or I haven't helped you get through something. There's a lot more to it than just being the loudest one on the field or only working hard. I think you have to work hard in all aspects.

Chelsea: I was going to show you something we talked about in class that went along with finding leadership styles. It's called the personality compass and what it is, it shows the north south east west and it shows what kind of quality traits they have. What we had to do was pick which one was more like us and one thing I noticed was I was more of a south so natural team player, process centered, slow paced, good listener, not confrontational, sensitive, patient, generous, understanding, helpful. I found myself in between south and east but just looking at that and reading some qualities on each of them do you notice one that stands out to you that best describes you?

Ashley: This is good stuff. I would say I'm in between a couple also. I would say between north and east. A couple qualities that stick out on each of those, natural leader and I think that goes by leading by example, that's always been my thing. Fast paced, I'm very goal centered and task oriented, confident, competitive and determined. Also I am a planner, very organized, I need everything to be done a certain way, focused on the goals and task I'm trying to overcome. Being structured is huge for me there needs to be structure especially as an assistant coach, and perfectionist. I would say between north and east. I can't really choose one of those.

Chelsea: We also talked about our opposites, people who we may have a harder time working with or getting along with. Is there one you see on there that you may have a difficult time working with or with their style of leadership.

Ashley: I think I would say west mainly because it says the flexibility is fine that's good to work with but spontaneous, free spirited, those aren't bad traits but for me I need structure in both my professions. I might be enthusiastic, free spirited in my personal self, as far as profession I need structure, I need organization and to me west seems like there's not a whole lot of that happening and kind of reminds me of our other assistant coach. It's been something else I'm learning as far as working with others, she very spontaneous and free spirited, she doesn't have a plan before the day starts and makes the plan as they days going, that's been a little bit difficult. Just because I work a different way, but it's definitely been a great learning experience for me in working with somebody that is opposite of how I do things.

Chelsea: I thought this page was really cool because since I noticed I was more south, my opposite was across from me the north because they are more assertive at times and that might overwhelm me and make me nervous. They try to work really fast paced and I need time to think about it. I noticed that and thought it was pretty cool to bring up in this interview.

Ashley: I definitely think the more we talk about it, I'm probably more of an east when it comes to being an assistant coach.

Chelsea: Just kind of thinking about this paper and other leadership styles. When playing with teammates professionally have you noticed various leadership styles, also have you noticed a leadership style you work best with, or don't work best with, I guess on a team aspect on the field.

Ashley: There's a ton of different leadership styles. It can be black and white or there can be some grey area. Depending on the person's personality and how they were brought up. I've noticed that the leadership styles I respond to the best are the people I respect the most and how they earn that respect is if they are out there putting in the work and not sitting on couch not working hard. I respond well to someone like that and someone who cares about my personal life as well. The game of softball does not define you as a person and you run into that a lot where teammates get hot heads or starts yelling and consider that leadership because they are yelling at you based off your performance and I lose a little bit of respect there because I think it's just a game, and that's not how I am defined as a person, friend or teammate. I think the ones who put in the work outside of the field too, to get to know me personally or know something about me or care about my personal life versus just how I perform in a game, those are the leaders I respond to the best. You see so many different styles, you can have someone who is too much like that, or too much in your business and it can be an extreme both ways. It could be someone in the middle who's understanding that there's other personalities and other leadership styles. If you can be understanding that's the battle is being understanding of not everyone's going to view this the same or be a leader in the same way if you can understand that everyone's going to be a little bit different than you grow as a leader yourself because your able to work with more people, more types of personalities. You never know what you're going to get on a team, especially being an assistant coach you never know what kind of players you are going to get, you obviously recruit a certain type but you never know how they are until they get to your school. Being able to work with kids with different personalities, there different leadership skills also. For example, last year we had a very structured and well-oiled senior leadership, they understood their roles and understood that they are there to empower the team and lead in the right direction as to before we got here as a coaching staff they were being led in the wrong direction. They understood it was going to be hard, they understood that the team needed them and the team responded very well to them. This year, we have a lot less seniors and the leadership is a lot different than what we had last year, they are more of the determined and dominant type, to where they will just tell you what needs to be done versus talking to you about your day. We have had a little bit of kickback with that, they are a lot more assertive people, a lot more north side. As a team, our team doesn't respond As well to that style, so there going through some growth and some learning also. They key is to be open minded enough and to understand there are different types.

Chelsea: Do you have a scenario where you butted heads with someone professionally and had to take a step back and try to see it from there side or see that there this type of leader so I need to adjust to how they are?

Ashley: While I was playing professionally there was one pitcher on the team that was a very assertive and very oppressive leader. She didn't care too much about what was going on outside of softball and she constantly was making demands which is how I saw it. I did not respond well to her so what I did was kept my distance. I ended up having to talk to her about how it was making me feel because I figured if it was making me feel this way then it could be making other teammates feel this way also. After that it went a little bit smoother, I was able to understand where she was coming from, she was aware that this was somewhat hurting the team versus helping. Whereas before if I hadn't talked to her, she might have not been aware that her style was not what this team was responding well to.

Chelsea: Just along with that, maybe a scenario where you worked well with a type of leadership, they could have been totally different than you but the two and two put together, it was a better outcome working together?

Ashley: As a player? As a professional player, I was playing second base and our shortstop, her name is Jill Barrett. She was a lot different player than I was, I'm a very serious focused player and I will get in my head too much to where If I make a mistake I'm only thinking about that mistake. Jill on the other hand, had a great understanding that what we were doing was playing a game and that's it, just a game. The way she led was through example and whenever I found myself getting into that negative mind, she was always free spirited, which is a lot different than I am. It balanced well with me because she was able to get me out of those mindsets that weren't very good. She was able to show me and teach me that it was just a game and it wasn't defining who I was. Just because I made that error, I was not a bad person. She was able to change my mind and morph my mind so when those situations happened, I had a different understanding. Although she was a completely different leader than I was. I led with structure, by example, by working hard. She led by example by being loose and understanding truly that it's just a game and being able to put it in a different perspective for people.

Chelsea: I kind of get that because with playing college softball, I feel that I do get serious during games, so sometimes having that opposite person who's more goofing around or just having fun, but still serious at the same time. They kind of make you take a step back and say "oh were having fun here, don't be so serious". I really get that side of things and getting along with a leadership style like that. Next question I had was, leaders help turn ideas into action and empower others. How do you accomplish this?

Ashley: By doing what you say you're going to do. It seems so simple, but it's actually really hard. Leaders can be visionaries and can understand the bigger picture, but if you're not working day in and day out doing those little things every day to accomplish or work towards that goal, then it's not going to end up where you want it to end up. You have to constantly be cognitive of what you're doing every day and if it's helping the team, empowering other teammates, if it's empowering your players. I'm constantly asking myself is there any way I could of helped one of my players today, did I miss any opportunities to have a conversation with them and discuss life. Did I miss any opportunities to impact them in a certain way today? The bigger picture is that you're doing this to become a better person and to take a lot of these lessons you learn in this game with you when you leave the game. Doing those little things day in and day out, that's taking action. Not doing this one big thing, or having this big speech about it. You can talk about it all day, but action is truly what's going to get you to where you want to be. It's a daily thing, it's a daily job. A lot of little things that go into it every single day and you have to be consistent with it.

Chelsea: So would you say, you kind of need to know the environment you're in as well, to maybe adjust your leadership style at times? Or have you ever tried to change your leadership style or adjust it because you knew people wouldn't respond as well with that type of style?

Ashley: I have done a lot of research on personalities, and I read a lot of books on personality and the different types of personalities you can have. We do a personality test, we give it to our players because we want to be able to coach this team how they want to be coached. We want to get the best out of them in the best way. So if they're going to respond to a certain type of leadership, then that's what we're going to do to get the best out of our players. There's been a lot of research done so I definitely don't stick to one leadership style, sometimes the team needs tough love, and you are a little bit more of a north. Sometimes your team needs a sensitive side, need to see that you care about them and love them, more so that one, and then tough love. I have learned that kids these days, young women these days respond a lot better to people they know love them and care about them and coaches that care about them as a person. Not just little pawns on our team. As far as leadership styles, we do so much research. I personally like the books that have to do with personality types, because you don't know until you read about how many personalities you could get. You're coaching a team of 20 young women so you will most likely get most of those personalities and have to adjust your coaching style or leadership style to whoever you're talking to.

Chelsea: I feel like it's also scenario based kind of too, there's certain situations maybe in a team environment where people are taken seriously and that's maybe when you need a leader to be more assertive. So, having those leadership styles, those adjustments, I see where that could be helpful.

Ashley: That reminds me of last year when we had the great senior leadership. We had five different seniors and they were all a little bit different. They were all kind of their own leadership style and they did well at taking on task that better fit their leadership style. They did a good job of determining who was going to deal with what task, or what needed to be done based off their strengths as a leader. There was a couple times where they picked the wrong person to confront the team about something because it wasn't their strength to confront it in the way that needed to be done, but as a whole, they really impressed me with there being different leadership styles and different situations where this leader takes care of this task based off your strengths and what the team needs at the time.

Chelsea: I know you touched on this throughout this interview. How does your leadership style change again maybe from your coaching profession?

Ashley: In the professional league, I am more of a friend. My leadership style is more relational. I like to create that relationship, that bond, and just be friends with my teammates. I don't have a lot of tiffs or arguments with my teammates. I'm very good a mediating situations and I'm fine with confrontation, the right confrontation. I think my teammates respect me for that and I'm open with them. They understand that I'm there to help this team, I'm not there selfishly, and I am there selflessly. As a coach, same thing with creating relationships, creating bonds, I like to know what's going on in my players lives and how there making it or how they are psychologically. I understand what we put them through physically, I want to know how there making it in all other aspects of life. I am a little more serious and focused, not as free spirited when it comes to being a coach. Players need structure and they need consistency and that's how were going to make them the best people they can be. I definitely take on more of a structured leadership role as a coach, then I do as a player. As a player, I am strictly there to empower these other women. Here, I am here to empower, but also discipline and hold accountable. If my players don't have that now while they are in college, it's going to be a lot harder for them to figure this out in the work force.

Chelsea: Do you think the leadership style differs from the head coach to the assistant coach?

Ashley: Head coaches, you have to be very aware of all of your actions. You want to be respected and seen a certain way. As an assistant you also want to be respected but your able to create those bonds a little bit more so than maybe a head coach would. You're able to talk to the players, and usually assistants are usually a little bit younger. Head coaches are usually older and have more experience. Assistants can kind of understand and relate a little more to players. Being a man or being a women, your coaching a team full of young women, my leadership role is more of an example type. As far as being a women in the work force, and has gone through these things to make myself stronger and that's an example for these young women. As a man you might not be able to relate as much to everything that a women could.

Chelsea: What or who has been your greatest influence?

Ashley: I would say my parents. I have seen them go through so much, sacrifice everything. I have seen them whenever we thought we wouldn't be able to go to Colorado to play a tournament, because of money, they found a way. I have seen them give me and my sister's unconditional love and unconditional serving us growing up. I want to be the best server I can be. I want to be that selfless, that giving, that loving, that caring for other people because if I can make half the sacrifices my parents did, then I'm really affecting people's lives. They're defiantly my biggest influence. I have seen all the qualities that I would like to have at that extent in life.

Chelsea: That's really cool! Your parents gave you a path to the leadership point that you're in now in life. What would you say your professional strengths and weaknesses were going along with this paper I showed you earlier, the personality compass? On the back we had to say some of our limitations. For my leadership style, I said slow paced could be a negative and being too sensitive could get me in a difficult situation with another leadership style. Do you know of any weakness or strengths?

Ashley: I would say one that kind of falls under a strength and a weakness for me is being a perfectionist. I mean it's a good thing to be a perfectionist, everything got done with quality, but also my standards sometimes are very high and that took a toll on me as a player and sometimes as an assistant coach also. I expect things to be a certain way and if I don't think I lived up to that expectation, it causes a little more stress or makes me question how well I do things. That is something I am learning to overcome. It is also a strength because I get things done with quality and even though it might not be the quality I expected or I wanted, it's still quality based off of other people's opinions or my bosses. A strength is being organized because things get done when you're managing a team of twenty plus the managers, plus the other staff, it's very important to be organized. Whenever you're making food orders or trying to get messages out to the team, I want to keep this team moving smoothly even if it's as little as making them understand recruits are coming in at a certain time. A weakness is probably being analytical as a player. As a player being analytical isn't great because you're always thinking and can't shut your mind off. You get into a groove to where you're not just playing the game but you are analyzing everything. That has got me into trouble a few times as a player.

Chelsea: We talked about the west side and working with different people if we were in a group. How, if we got everyone from the west side to work in a group, nothing may get done, it may be a really interesting project but it might not ever be delivered or turned in. That's interesting those strengths and weaknesses. How do you measure success and how do you learn from failure

Ashley: I measure success based off of my own reflection. I used to measure success on how my team was doing or how the team I was coaching was doing. I measured if they did well then I was doing well. You have to be careful with that, there's a fine line because sometimes you put in all that you can, you give all you have, but the team or players don't perform or it hasn't clicked yet. I measure it off of personally reflecting. Did I give everything I could today to my players, did I miss an opportunity to impact them in any way and how do you learn from failure? Playing a sport of failure has really helped me with this. You get to a point where you understand that were all humans and were going to fail. The way to learn from it is there are coping mechanisms, we even teach our players how to deal with failure and getting to that red zone in your mind and switching it over back to green. There's definitely those little things that I do also, but ultimately knowing that you're going to fail and picking one thing from that failure that's going to help you next time and using that to motivate you. If you can do that then failure won't be that big of a deal anymore knowing that your constantly learning and if that motivates you to do better next time then that's a good thing, failure is good.

Chelsea: Can you touch on red and green and what you mean by that?

Ashley: Whenever we do our mental conditioning we use a really known guy named Brian Cain for our mental training. Softball is physical but mostly it's mental so we spend a lot of time on the mental side of the game. What he talks about is after you make an error or mess up in any way, you start to have negative thoughts or in your mind tear yourself down, or get to that red zone. He teaches ways to get back to green which is back to a confident player, someone who takes that mistake and uses it in appositive way. A few ways he talks about is taking deep breaths, having a release as far as picking up some dirt and throwing it. Whatever release works for the player, it's a trial an error kind of deal.

Chelsea: What advice do you have for building relationships and trust in an organization. I know you talked about building relationships with your players as an assistant coach, but maybe having that same kind of building relationships with your head coach as well. Sometimes you'll see at colleges that the head coach and assistant coach don't click and aren't on the same page. How do you go about building relationships in that way?

Ashley: I think there's a couple big things into doing this well. One is you read in all the books that talk about leadership, it all comes down to love and care. If you truly love what you are doing, this will come easier to you because you will enjoy building those relationships, and enjoy bonding with your team and players and being translucent with everyone around you. Also, understanding your role, understanding that I am an assistant coach and that is the head coach. What he says goes, he's the boss, and he has done this and learned from experience. Whether I agree with some things or not that's something we talk about personally together. You'll get into the issue a lot with coaching staffs that might not agree, but they handle that disagreement in front of their players and not the best ways they could. For me if he says something that goes, I'll go back to his office and ask why we did this. Just so we have time to talk about it and confront the situation in a healthy way and not something that would be misunderstood between players. Building trust has to do with if players know you care about them and have their best interest in your heart truly, then they will trust you and go to great lengths for you.

Chelsea: Coming down on the last couple of questions. What do you want your legacy to be?

Ashley: That's a good question. I want to be known for working really hard and having quality work. Whether that's me playing or me being a coach, giving everything I have and working the hardest I possibly can. I think that's the biggest lesson you can do. Nowadays even with technology and society, people are wanting easier ways to do things. Which is fine but in return makes some people lazy because they think they have an easier way, so they don't have to work as hard. I think if you have an easier way plus your working hard then we can do great things. I want to be known for being the hardest worker, being the first one on the field and first one off, that type of philosophy. Also, just truly caring about people. I don't believe in judging others for anything, I want people to know that I love them. That's what you're here for, you're here to love, create relationships with other people and I think if I can be known for those two things then I'll be accomplished.

Chelsea: Lastly, we read a lot of leadership books in our Global Leadership Class. Do you have a book, or what is a book recommendation that you can suggest to read that you have read before?

Ashley: There is a lot of books out there that you can read. One that comes to mind is called Leadership Fitness. That book is good for ones that are just now getting into the leadership role or just now curious about it. It's a great book because it not only speaks about leadership qualities and the difference in leadership styles, but it also has exercises in that book. I received that book when I was in one of my leadership classes in college and it started the change for me. It helped me adjust my leadership style and improve it. Like I said there's a lot of exercises, there's a lot of questions that it will ask you to make you reflect on the type of leader you are, how you can be better, what your strength is and it has a lot of great stories from successful coaches in there as well. It uses their experiences and ties it into a lot of the leadership styles we talked about throughout this interview.

Chelsea: Awesome! I'm definitely going to have to read that, but thank you for meeting with me today and I really enjoyed hearing your background.

Ashley: Thank you for having me