Interview with Bonnie Marschner, November 14, 2017

Bonnie Marschner, transcript, November 14, 2017

Reese: Okay so the first question is what part of your personal biography or background led you to be a study abroad adviser?

Marschner: My story is not probably unique compared to other study abroad advisors but I studied abroad and college myself and majored in Spanish and I spent a semester in Costa Rica with a provider. That was probably the most impactful experience I've had in college just in terms of being a transformational semester, being able to improve my Spanish language skills, and just feeling like I grew so much as a person and had such a wider and broader perspective of the world. Then I decided I semester wasn't enough time so I lived abroad for a year and Argentina I only wanted to have the experience of living independently and just to see if I could do it and I wasn't sure exactly what I wanted to do professionally when I graduated and then I came back from the experience and I did some soul-searching and didn't even know International Education was a field. I ended up taking a random job in inside sales and was miserable. Then I actually started doing some research and asked well what is it that I love? What am I passionate about? I always was coming back to that experience I had a broad and interacting with people from different cultures and being able to use my Spanish language skills. Then I realized that this is an actual field. I got my foot in the door actually by working at English Language Institute and I was doing admissions there. But really I would say my own personal experience as a student studying and living abroad is what let me here. I feel like for most people it's hard to be in this job if you can't relate to other students and if you can't understand some of the challenges that you face from studying and living abroad but also the really just the impact it can make on your life. Yeah, I would say just my own personal experience as a student. I know I'm the right field because it doesn't even feel like I have to come to work most days because I'm so passionate about study abroad and enabling other students to have the opportunity to take advantage of that experience while they're in college.

Reese: What did you do for the year in Argentina?

Marschner: I thought English. I didn't go through an actual program. I knew I wanted to practice my Spanish because I was Spanish major and I didn't have the language skills that I was comfortable with that major, so I went with a friend. We never actually had been to Argentina before, but we just bought a plane ticket. We found out that English is really the best avenue for finding a job when you're an American looking for work. And we taught, I actually didn't work with kids, I worked with adults. I worked for English Language Institutes and then I would contract out at different companies and businesses. I taught the CEO of a company for one of the teaching jobs. It was very intimidating, but I also realized English is the lingua Franca of business. They really want to you know have the right pronunciation and they want to practice their fluency and so that was a confidence-booster for me because I was someone who had no business background, I didn't take any business classes in college, but it didn't matter because I was a native English speaker. He was extremely humble and I hope he learned from me. I realized I had a skill that he was trying to perfect. I taught English for a year and just did what I could to practice my Spanish and taught private English lessons on the side. Living on your own is completely different than a study abroad experience because I didn't have an organization there helping out to navigate the culture. It was overwhelming but I think it really built my confidence and made me realize if I can survive in a foreign country where most people do not know English, there's over 7 million people that live in Buenos, and if I can figure out the public transportation system, and I can teach classes to people that are 20 years my senior, and I can find my own apartment, and pay my bills, and figure out all the daily tasks in a country that's not even my own then I can do anything. I mean when I look back on some of the best years in my twenties, I think my experience in Argentina was probably more formative than any study abroad experience because I was doing it on my own and I was living and working there. I wasn't one a structured program and I had to figure out how to make money to survive because I had no job when I started there. I learned to just be resourceful and have confidence that you can do what you set your mind to do.

Reese: What cultural experiences are most salient to you? You kind of answered some of that when you mentioned Argentina.

Marschner: Yeah, I wasn't sure what you meant by that, in terms of what experiences that I've had abroad or any kind of experience?

Reese: Any kind of cultural experiences that relate to your job or becoming better as a leader or whatever cultural experiences you want to talk about abroad too.

Marschner: I would say for me some of the most intercultural experiences I've had have been my times studying abroad as a student and then working in Argentina. One of the most impactful pieces of my experience in Costa Rica was living with a family. I lived with a couple who had four little kids. They opened up their home to myself and then two other American girls and they just took us in as their second kids and they would have done anything for us. We were essentially strangers and they were concerned about our well-being. They only spoke Spanish to us. They took us to their, they have a thing called a finca, which is kind of like a family farm. They just were interested in learning more about us and opening up their lives and their home to us and that was really impactful to me because I hadn't really had, I mean you have your parents, but you don't really have the opportunity to live with another family when you're in college. You're used to being on your own and having to take care of yourself. I think you just realize when you live with another family from a different culture, different upbringing, different values that we have a lot more similarities than differences. The lifestyle there is a lot simpler so they were technically middle class, but the dad was a carpenter so he had built half of the house. They really didn't have disposable income, so the idea of going on a vacation and spending any money on clothes or additional things. They didn't have decorations up everywhere. They have very simple furniture and it was just it was just a good lesson for me that sometimes the simplest things are the better. I just really appreciate that they took me in. It just makes you realize that we're all just humans and we're all citizens of the world. I might be American and I might come from a different cultural background, but we're all just people. We all have the same basic needs. Yeah, it was really positive experience for me. In terms of other cultural experiences, I taught English when I came back so that was a way for me to contribute to the community. I taught English in Athens, Georgia and it was through a nonprofit. That was just inspiring because you realize that people have left their families or taken a huge risk to come for a better life and a better opportunity in the United States. They're willing to work these jobs were there working, I mean a lot of these people were working night shifts 7 days a week and they were still making it a priority to learn English and assimilate the best they could and they never complained about anything. That was a way for me to use my Spanish language skills and was also a humbling experience because you learn about where these people come from, their culture, and they're willing to work so hard because they see the opportunities in the States as so much better than where they came from. They're willing to put in extra hours after work just to learn English skills. That was that was something that was positive for me. Also, just seeing students connect. Although I'm not able to go abroad and have these experiences abroad for a semester anymore, I love seeing other students connect and make friendships. Whether it's you taking on a leadership role yourself and really making the international students feel welcome by going to the international retreat or, Kathy told me you took the students to Gatlinburg. That makes a difference for those students who are studying abroad here and they'll take that back to their home communities and they'll have a good impression of the Unites States and the Americans here. When I see students who want to volunteer and who have this opportunity to live abroad and they want to give back and then I see them going to the coffee hour or I've seen some of the students connect in the tutoring hour. I've seen those who, Evan is coming to mind and he studied in France and he's really connected with one of the French students here. You just realize there's so much positive that comes from living abroad, having the experience abroad and just being more empathetic to where people are coming from.

Reese: Okay so what does leadership mean to you?

Marschner: Leadership. To me leadership means being able to be a role model and advocate for a team. There's the tradition leader who's managing a team, but I don't think you necessarily have to be the manager to show leadership. I think that leadership means being collaborative\ and working well with a team and acknowledging that everyone has a role and that everyone has a voice. I think traditionally in society, leadership are viewed as people who are in charge and always the managers and sometimes who have a certain kind of personality or the loudest voice making all the decisions, but I don't think that. I think everyone is able to be a leader and can contribute and to show their strengths in different ways. I don't think there's particularly one right to lead. I don't think there's a formula. I think it just comes down to everyone has different strengths and personalities, but I do think that leaders should be able to practice what they preach. If you're going to have expectation of other people then you need to be willing to do that yourself and be able to motivate people to some degree.

Reese: That's what we talked about in class how there's not one right way to and there's not necessarily, you know we talk about democratic, authoritarian, and all these different styles and it's kind of a combination of them. You're never usually just one style or one type of leader

Marschner: Right and it depends on what role you play in an organization. If you're a manager then that is your title and if there are certain decisions that someone has to be the ultimate decision maker, but I think that a true leader is very team oriented and collaborative. You're only as strong as your entire team. So somebody who's not only inwardly focused and thinking about what's the best decision for them but really what's best for their entire office, the entire team, the organization because that's when you're going to have the best and most effective results or team.

Reese: I agree with a lot of the things you've been saying. What experiences have most shaped you as a leader?

Marschner: I think really observing how other people lead. I have leadership opportunities in terms of leader students and I think with each job that I've had. I'm 34 so I've had a number of different jobs and worked under a lot of different type of people with different leadership styles. That's been helpful for me to observe and realize what I personally align with, what I don't align with, what I think is effective, and what I don't think it effective. I'd say the main thing for me has been observing and taking note. In terms of my own leadership experience most of that has been in working with students. What I've learned from working with students is that you need to be every clear with what you're expectations are upfront. Trying to communicate clearly what it is you expect from student volunteers or from the grad assistance I work with. I think listening is also extremely important. A lot of times we think of leaders as the ones who are dictating how things are going to go but I think sometimes the most effective people are the ones listening to their team and getting feedback because you can't possible know what's going to you know, there's so many tasks an office is responsible for that there's no way that one person is going to know what's best for everybody and the task at hand. Students have really great ideas too so I find that some of the best ideas I get come from students and from some of the challenges they've had from volunteering or whatever they are trying to do, such as getting them to come to events or trying to recruit students. Feedback is very important and taking that into account and having open lines of communication. I also think that gratitude and appreciate goes a long way. Some of the greatest problems I've had with some of the leaders I work under is that sometimes a lot of people don't so their appreciation. It's as simple as saying thank you so much for doing that or you're working really hard. Words of affirmation to keep people motivated. They don't need a lot but sometimes just a pat on the back to acknowledge that they're working hard. It's amazing how many people do not show appreciation or acknowledgment. It can really affect the morale.

Reese: I totally agree. Last semester I took an organizational communication class and we talked about how so many times you get told the bad things that you're doing but not necessarily the good things that you're doing. I mean it makes a difference because you can love doing something so much but if you're doing it day in and day out and not getting any recognition for it, then it's so hard to continue.

Marschner: I think that's key too. If you're doing your job well, some leaders don't acknowledge when it's going smoothly because they don't take the time but it's only when something is not going well or you've made an error that they acknowledge that. And I think it can be detrimental, so I have made it a point to show gratitude when students are volunteering their time because that's not something that you have to do or with our graduate assistance; I can't do my job without them. This is the first place I've worked where I manage graduate assistance. I've noticed that when I and maybe it's just that the people we've hired have been great, but when I send emails and just thank them for working on something or tell them they're doing a great job or have great idea, I think it motivates people to work hard. They know they're being recognized and their work is not being overlooked. It's funny how some people don't take the time to do that.

Reese: Exactly. It's a simple thing to. If it's an email it may be an extra three seconds to type out a thank you.

Marschner: It's a very simple thing. I don't think people intentionally don't do it. It's just that I don't think some leaders are conscious of that because they are so focused on the deadline or things like that so they don't spend as much time of thinking about how is it that we were able to complete these tasks and what did people do to make this happen outside of what I did individually.

Reese: You answered a little bit of the leadership qualities you have to have in order to be a study abroad adviser, but are there more?

Marschner: Yeah so these are actually a little bit different. I think to be a study abroad adviser you need to have patience because you're working with students. A lot of students come in and they are very indecisive and they may not have done any research or out any thought into where they want to study abroad. They just one a whim decided that they wanted to study abroad and then they come in and sit down and they haven't thought about what classes they want to take or the financial piece so I think patience is the key. It's also very administrative and I think a lot of people view working in study abroad as glamour or that you get to take to students studying abroad and then you can go abroad yourself, but really most of it is administrative work and advising. A lot of it is managing the application, which can be a grind. The volume is very high and so I think you just have to be patient and recognize the bigger picture, which is encouraging and facilitating students to study abroad. I think empathy is also important. Any time you're advising students, whether it's academic adviser, counselor, I mean in a way we are counselors. We have to put ourselves in student's shoes because everyone's coming from a different place. Yes, I have studied abroad, but there are certain students who come in and have never been on a plane or left the United States. It could be huge obstacle or a huge stepping stone for them to go even somewhere for a week or two. Really trying to understand this is a big decision for a lot of students, which is why the patience part is important. For some students this is a huge leap for them and so I try to remember and relate to that Even if they are abroad and there are challenges they encounter, I try to remember that this could be the first time they are away from home. It may seem like something minor to me, but I always need to put myself in student's shoes.

Reese: I agree. When I did my Maymester in Switzerland, on the way down this mountain there were four of us that decided to hike down this mountain and everyone else decided to take the gondola back down. Half way down the trail was closed so we had to figure out a different way to get down the mountain. I had one person who was wanted to climb through the danger zone who thought it would be fine to do that. Then I had two students who had never studied abroad before or traveled outside the U.S., so I understand trying to understand others. For me it wasn't a big deal because I could still see the city. I've had experience with being lost before and that kind of thing or not being able to get somewhere. I was used to it, but these two students were not used to it. It's hard to put yourself in their mind when you've already experienced that kind of thing.

Marschner: Right, so you think this is something that is not insurmountable and that it's not a big deal, but that's just your perspective. And I think what you just talked about, problem solving skills and how are you going to get down the mountain. In study abroad we are dealing with so many things that are outside of just the tradition study abroad role. If there is an emergency abroad, so let's say that there was a terrorist attack we have to be able to react really quickly to that and make sure that everyone is accounted for. When there is a housing or mental health issue or if the student is having trouble with classes or roommates, those all become out problems and you need to be able to think quickly. Even though the students are living thousand miles away they are still Belmont students and they are still my advisees and I have to be able to react quickly and rationally and step in to help that student because we have to make sure they feel safe and supported. There's a lot of problems solving involved because everyday something comes up. It could be something minor but sometimes it's something major and we have to put everything aside to take care of it because of somebody's health, wellbeing, or safety is a risk then we have to take care of it. That wasn't something I was necessarily expecting.

Reese: Yeah when you said that I wouldn't have expected that either.

Marschner: It's not just application management. We are here for the student for the whole cycle so prospective, getting their money to go abroad, when they're abroad, when they come back and supporting them with reentry, and then also making sure their grades come back in, as well as helping students who are looking for the next step. It's a lot more layered than I was expecting. But that's what makes it worthwhile because it's not just one dimensional. You're involved with every aspect of the students going and coming back from being overseas. Then, the last thing is just encouragement and positivity. Some students pay just need that extra push to take that step. I'm not saying that students wouldn't do that on their own, but sometimes they need that extra little nudge to say you can you this. We will help you, you are not on your own, this will be a life changing experience for you, this is the time to do it, it's okay to be uncomfortable, it's okay for it to be hard, but I promise you when you come back you will not regret it and you will come back changed in some way, shape, or form. I think if I was indifferent or didn't have a positive attitude with students it would rub off of them to where they would just say never mind. I try to be persistent with them and check in on them because I think some students really need that.

Reese: Do you feel it's important to delegate in your job and if so, why?

Marschner: Absolutely. I think delegate is right word. I don't know if you talked about it in your class, but this is something I've also noticed some people struggle with in leadership positions. I don't know if it's that they don't want to give up ownership or they are micromanage what's going on, but my personal experience has been that the more that I am able to delegate, this more I am effective and the more efficient the office is. There's no reason that I need to be up to my neck in tasks and working overtime if there is someone else who can do it just as well as me it's gives them an opportunity as well to take on some leadership. I'm all about delegating. I think everyone needs to recognize that we can't be 100% good at everything. I think it's important to recognize what your limitations are and that's also being team focus. We're all in this together and there's no reason that I need to be the one to take care of every single thing related to study abroad advising. I do think that it empowers students and the graduate assistants I oversee as well. Course approvals is a very complex process and is very time consuming and tedious. I could do it, but I would be so stressed out if I had to take on that task by myself. Let's say we send 50 students abroad a semester and they all have to have 10 classes abroad so that's 500 classes. I cannot do that in a work day. I would have to be working to 8 or 9 at night. I wouldn't be happy about that. I don't know how efficient I would be or if I would be at my optimum performance anyway, so I've started passing that to the graduate assistants and they've done a great job. They've come up with their own system and check in with me. I'm still there to support and guide them, but it empowers them. They can use it as a resume builder. It's allowing them to oversee an entire process that is very important to the day to day of our office. It's nothing we necessarily talk about, but it is very important behind the scenes. It help me, it gives the student an opportunity to take on some leadership so I think it is a win-win situation. Same thing with peer advising, but I'll talk about it later.

Reese: Okay, the next question is since coming to Belmont you've improved the Belmont Ambassador program and why was this one of the first things you did when you came here?

Marschner: Thank you for acknowledging that. I've been here for about two year. I've been in higher education for a while but I have never officially been a study abroad adviser before, but I've been on the other side of things and worked with international students and ambassadors. When I came in I recognized that that was an area that was underdeveloped and that there was also a need for more support so I thought with my prior knowledge and skills I've used in past jobs, I think that I can revamp and improve this program. I saw a gap and I just used my own expertise and skills from the past to try and see how I could push the office forward and contribute to making it more efficient. The issue was that I'm the only semester adviser right now. We just hired a new adviser, but that's for faculty led programs. The volume is less for me, but the advising is much more detailed. I spend sometimes 30 minutes to an hour on one student. I had days where I was spending 3 to 4 hours advising, which is half my day. That is also just a portion of what I do. Even though I'm a study abroad adviser, we also do application management, information session, hosting providers when they come on campus, and having to manage transcripts, course pre approvals and crises abroad. Advising cannot take up that much time for me so I asked what could I do to help me, to give students an opportunity, and also make the office more efficient for when students come in for walk-in advising so they can be seen quicker and not have to wait two hours and then not actually get to see me. I decided to beef up the ambassador program because before they would only help with the study abroad fair. I thought about what I needed help with, I need help with advising. All these students come back from going abroad and say let me know if you need help in the office. I would love to give back. I would love to help other students throughout the application process. I would love to share my experience. So I realized I have students asking me how they can help and I need help so I thought, how can I connect these two together. Students are going to be more motivation than me because I'm still a staff. Students might not always relate to me in the way that they might relate to you when you've just come back from Victoria University and being a Belmont student they may listen to you more than to what I have to say in terms of why they should go abroad. I thought I would give it try so a lot of it is trial and error. The Belmont Abroad Ambassadors program has been around for a while, but to this degree it's been a little over a year since we've done peer advising. As a result my advising has gone down tremendously. I'm less stressed out. I hope it's been a positive experience for the ambassadors because it gives them the opportunity to take on some leadership. It's also a resume builder. They are able to talk about study abroad and can really make a difference in somebody else going abroad. You're helping the office. Hopefully, the end goal is that we're sending more students abroad and we're getting more students through the office in a shorter amount of time. Also, we're able to use you all to help with information sessions and anyway you're willing to get involved. It's still a working progress. There's always room for improvement, but I am proud of it and I hope it has made a difference. I hope it has been empowering for students. I know there are a lot of different directions to take it but I think you have to start somewhere.

Reese: I like that you can get involved after you've studied abroad. I think it was when I came back from Australia that you started implementing the program because it was fall last year. I've been it grow and ramp up. I like participating in the peer advising and just being able to still talk about your time abroad and encourage other people to go abroad.

Marschner: Yeah, I know some days students are waiting around and there's nobody that comes in and there are other days when it's really busy, but it's still really helpful to know that I don't have to feel the weight of advising every single students that comes in here and that it gives you opportunities for leadership so we have the training. There's always room for growth, so I wish I had more hours in the day to devote to developing the program and spending more time with you all, but it's a work in progress and that's why I need feedback from you guys, what's working and what's not working. You have to start somewhere though so I'm glad that we have it in place. Now it's a matter of how are we going to make this better, how are we going to get people more involved, how are we going to make feel more empowered and that they can contribute more and more.

Reese: That kind of goes with thinking about Belmont Abroad Ambassadors and grad students who work for the office and how the delegation help not only you but other. You talked about ambassadors getting leadership roles.

Marschner: Yeah I think I already talked about this so I don't want to be too repetitive because I know I can ramble, but yeah I think it just gives students leadership opportunities to feel empowered. I also think it give them a greater sense of purpose in terms of giving back from their study abroad experience.

Reese: What are your professional strengths and weaknesses?

Marschner: Professional strengths I would say I am very student centered, which I think is very crucial in a job like this. I come to work every day and I am devoted to how I can best serve the students at Belmont and make their study abroad experience the best possible for them, whether that's helping to make the application process easier, the advising process easier, and then getting them on the program that's the best fit. I am very student centered, which is key to this job. I am also very team-oriented and collaborative. This is a small office, and a lot of study abroad offices are very small unless you are working at a huge public or private university where you have 10-20 people, but that brings other challenges, but I think you can do the job by yourself. You need the support of the people around you and you constantly, like I said with problem solving that maybe something arises where I need support from Thandi or someone else in the office. I think working as a team is crucial really in any job, but especially in study abroad because we're all working toward a common goal of facilitating the study abroad experience so we send more students abroad and make it accessible to as many students as possible. We can't do that by ourselves. Also, strong interpersonal communication skills is a strength because most of the interaction I have are going to be one-on-one or in a small group so being able to relate well to students and being able to work well with departments across campus. I'm having to bed able to liaise with student affairs, the professional development center, and the registrar's office. You really need to be able to work well with others and build alliances because we work with some many different departments across campus since we're working across majors. I think I am empathetic, I can relate well to others, I get along well with others and that's important for this job because I have to work with students, staff, and faculty. I have to touch basically every type of person that comes through campus. In terms of weaknesses, I think sometimes I can be inward focused. While I do work well on a team, I can get bogged down with everything that I have on my plate because there is a lot of work for all of us. I need to be mindful that this may be a crazy week for me, but there's also the faculty led programs that deal with a really high volume and they have a lot going on so just trying to be mindful that we are all busy and some days are busier than other. I need to remember that what is a top priority for me may not be top priority for somebody else if they've got something else that is a deadline they have to reach. We all work together but we also work independently in terms of the different tasks we oversee and the way we divide up programs. I am semester and we've got two people handling faculty led, and then Thandi who oversees everything. I just try to remember that everyone has different priorities and things they are trying to get done and that my sense of urgency might not always be someone else's sense of urgency. I also don't love public speaking. I can do it and I will do it, but that's something I think I could always improve on. It's important in the job because we give information sessions and are trying to promote programs to students. I would say though that that's not my favorite part of the job. I prefer the smaller communication settings, but it's an important piece of the job so it's something that I need to try to practice and continue to put myself in front of groups. I am not afraid of public speaking by any means, but I would say some people thrive off of it and I would not say I am one of those people. In terms of seeking out professional opportunities as well I think that can be a challenge. The field has grown so quickly and there's so many different ideas out there on how to improve processes and different professional development opportunities so I think I could do more in terms of putting myself out there in terms of presenting at conferences or taking more time to see what's being researched. That part is tough because of how detail oriented our job is. It's hard to remember the bigger picture of education and continuing to stay up to date on what other schools are doing and ideas because that's sometime the best way to improve the office, to see what other people are doing but also to acknowledge that I have information that may be helpful to other people too and to be mindful of that and put myself out there more in terms of networking in the field. Some people are very good at that and it's something I struggle with because there are so many things I have to do here and coming up with a presentation idea and presenting it in front of 500 people is not something I am drawn to. However, when it comes to leadership in terms of being recognized in the field, sharing information is part of it.

Reese: How do you measure success and how do you learn from failure?

Marschner: I measure success by if you are finding fulfillment in what you do every day and you are giving your best at your job every day and doing what you can to contribute to the common goal of the office. I don't think it's necessarily something that's quantifiable. I know a lot of people base success on how many students we are sending abroad. Let's say I am able to recruit 30 more people to study abroad, that is great, but that does not necessarily mean that those students are having a more fruitful experience or that they feel supported. I think success is something that is different for each individual. If you are happy coming to work every day and you are contributing then that is success. I think when you start becoming complacent and just doing the minimum to get by, then that's when it's time to reevaluate what's going on. I also see success in my job specifically in terms of encouraging a student who maybe wouldn't have gone abroad otherwise. If a student comes up to me and says because you I studied abroad, then to me that's a success. For me, my goal is for students to feel encouraged and that study abroad is a possibility, and helping them make that a reality. In terms of failure, how do you learn from failure? I think that failure is an opportunity for you to look back and see how you can learn from your mistakes and move forward. I don't think it's something you should focus on or be too hard on yourself. It's more like okay let me look at that as objectively as I can and see what I can do differently next time so I can either improve my situation or to potentially be successful the next time. It should be seen as a learning opportunity and you shouldn't focus too much on the past and try to always be moving forward to improve yourself.

Reese: We're going to skip down actually to the last question if you don't mind. What do you want your legacy to be?

Marschner: This is a hard one too Megan. Do you mean as a person?

Reese: I think a person, professionally, or as a leader.

Marschner: Okay, let me see what I wrote here. II want to be remembered as someone who always looks for the good in other people, who strives to encourage others to see their value, and as someone who truly cares about her work and encourages students to really step out of their comfort zone to engage with the world. In study abroad, I want to be remembered as someone who has had a positive impact on the office and on moving study abroad forward, whether that means sending more students abroad or improving processes, or whether that means making it accessible to a wider group of students. I mean I don't know where I'm going to be in five years, but I hope that people will remember that I was here and that I improved the office for the better in terms of making it more efficient and reaching a wider group of students that wouldn't have had access to study abroad otherwise. Also, as someone who was really devoted to her job and really cared about the students. Who came to work every day with the student's best interest at mind and who did everything possible to help make study abroad a reality for our students. I hope that people will look back on me fondly and as someone who was collaborative, easy to work with, and kind person who shows humility. That's a very hard question because I don't like to think of legacy as I'm not going to be here or as the past. I don't know if that answers your question.

Reese: Yeah. Thank you so much for doing the interview.

Marschner: Yeah, you're welcome.