Interview of Catherine Mallanda, November 7, 2020

Pria Sharma: Oh, hello.

Catherine Mallanda: Hi.

Pria Sharma: Hey, how are you?

Catherine Mallanda: I'm good, how are you?

Pria Sharma: Ok, so I already told you a little bit about what the interview is for, but if you wouldn't mind just introducing yourself, saying what your job is, that kind of thing.

Catherine Mallanda: I am Catherine Mallanda. I am a high school principal in a suburb of Atlanta, Marietta, Georgia, school of about twenty seven hundred very high performing schools in our state, also usually nationally ranked in the top hundred and fifty. And this is my third year, third year being the principal.

Pria Sharma: Yes. OK, so the first question, I know that what. So your college major is not something that would traditionally lend itself to a career in education, let alone as a principal. So can you kind of explain like where you started in college and how you got to this point?

Catherine Mallanda: Sure. So um I was always naturally good at math and science. That's just my strength, that's my area. I grew up with a father who's an engineer and he actually is an electrical engineer in the nuclear power industry, so I knew a lot about the nuclear power industry. It was always curious to me. So I went to Georgia Tech with the idea of being a nuclear engineer, which I did finish. But about two years into it was like, what am I thinking? First of all, I like people a lot. I'd like to talk. And I really had no idea what I wanted to do. I applied to every college with a different major from everything from nursing to teaching to engineering. So that was kind of always in that math science, but all over the board. So about halfway through college, when I realized you are not going to move to a small town where nuclear power plant is and be happy, what can I do now? And I went ahead. I found that you could take four classes, graduate, student teach, and be a teacher. And I had been one of those people that I tutored all my friends- and or I have to admit, maybe did their homework sometimes. And because I liked math and I would do anybody, you know, like, hey, do math problems, not my sounds good to me. So I was like, that's something I'm naturally good at, something I love.

Catherine Mallanda: Let's see how this goes. And I also was like, probably because I have much younger siblings. I was that kid that, like, babysat all the time all through high school, you know, like I babysat through college. I babysat every weekend. It was my, like, part time job. So I've always loved kids and I've always loved math. And so I just was like, OK, well, I'm going to try this because I didn't want to leave Atlanta. I didn't want to leave my family. You know, my dad had traveled he hadn't lived with my family since middle school because if you're going to live where nuclear power plants are there, like literally eight man towns. I mean, I live there. So I was like, OK, bad idea. New career. Stepped in the classroom, the first time to student teaching was like, oh my gosh, I picked the right thing. It was awesome. And I loved it. Taught for about seven years. And I was teaching B.S. calculus advanced. So which is kids who are taking a second year of calculus. Loved it. I was not academically challenged. Teaching wise, I was challenged, you could always find new ways to teach and better ways to teach, but academically, content wise, I wasn't that challenged. I also had been coaching, cheerleading. I had been the senior class sponsor. I had created the senior breakfast, which Pria knows what that is.

Pria Sharma: Yes wow very involved. I didn't know all this

Catherine Mallanda: It started out with, like, you know, a couple of moms and some casseroles and and.

Catherine Mallanda: Homemade, really homemade price is right things. It turned into a huge thing in our school, so I had been given a lot of leadership opportunities. They asked me to run a summer tutoring program one year and then I so I finished my specialist in math and went back, got certified to be leadership and finally decided if I turned my principal down one more time to get into a leadership role, I might not get it again. So I figured out a way to do part time time: part time administrator, half-time teacher for three years and then, you know, just kind of went into administration, but yes certainly started out in a very different ideal, but I will tell you one of the things I tell people, we have a STEM academy at our school, and I was talking to the eighth graders and I was explaining to them, to me what's great about a STEM background is not necessarily that you're going to go out and be a doctor or an engineer or a scientist, but it's that engineering design, that problem solving that having to break something up, having to look at constraints, having to look at what can go wrong and looking and being able to balance it. That decision making is what I do every day. It's never changed that design for that critical thinking that, you know, that is all the same in everything I do, said, wow, it's so different. It's really almost the same thinking process.

Pria Sharma: It's the same thought process. And you said that you went back and got a leadership certificate. So is that like an add on to your degree?

Catherine Mallanda: Yeah. So first I got a master's in math education because obviously being an engineer, I really knew nothing about pedagogy. I was teaching based on instinct and how I wanted to learn, not on like so, you know, really, I needed to learn some skills on, you know, what if a student didn't learn the way I did. And so I did that first and then I got a specialist. I got an add on in leadership and I got my specialist in leadership. And then I got my Ph.D. in educational leadership also.

Pria Sharma: Very cool. Yes. Well, then perfect for global leadership class.

Pria Sharma: You've got all the leadership degrees anyone can get.

Catherine Mallanda: Yes all the leadership degrees. Absolutely, absolutely

Pria Sharma: Ok, so when you were younger, like little kid, did you know that you wanted to have a leadership role? Like did you, did you naturally gravitate towards being more of a leader or more of a follower?

Catherine Mallanda: I was so shy at school. I mean, so like, I was great at home. Only child loud, obnoxious at home. But I was that quiet kid, so certainly not. I remember my seventh grade teacher who ended up being friends with my parents, told my mom years later that she worried because I used to come in and sit in class and I didn't talk for the first six months. So no, I probably had zero leadership skills as a kid personality. And it's still not my favorite thing to do. Like, I love to problem solve. I probably don't love the having to, you know, to do the political side, just not my. So that's not natural.

Pria Sharma: The public speaking part

Catherine Mallanda: Now, let me talk about what the public speaker I've gotten way better at the public speaking. I just- it's that the social part of it maybe.

Pria Sharma: Yes.

Catherine Mallanda: You've got to do it. Just maybe not my favorite.

Pria Sharma: So how did you kind of get to that point from being- was there did you just kind of get thrown into it and you're like, I guess I have to learn or did you have to kind of develop it?

Catherine Mallanda: Well, I think I think part of it well, first of all, when I got to college, obviously, I did a lot of clubs in high school and I did leadership roles there. So then I learned like, hey, you're pretty good at - pretty good task person. You're pretty good at getting things done. And then when I got to college, I was in leadership in my sorority multiple years and then I realized that, hey, I can actually people will if I come up with a good, solid plan and can explain it, people will follow. Like it doesn't, you can lead all you want and if no one follows it doesn't matter. And then I think I just kind of gained those skills through coaching, teaching. You know, I lead my curriculum team. I mean, you just you learn those skills and then you got to figure out like. I heard a great thing by John Maxwell, which I don't know if you've ever read any of his stuff, he's a leader. He writes about leadership in education, especially. And he he came and spoke to us once and he said, well, you've got to make sure we make sure your weaknesses don't hold you back, but what you really do is you work on your strengths. You become the best in certain areas, and then you make sure your parts you're not as good at are good enough. Right. So I like when I first became in charge of curriculum and instruction at my school, which was about 15 years ago, I had to start doing parent presentations. I was petrified.

Catherine Mallanda: Like seek me from a group of parents now - whatever. I speak at graduation, you know, no big deal, right?

Catherine Mallanda: But it's taken me years you know, a few years, to get comfortable in those situations. Those are not my favorite. Yeah.

Pria Sharma: So you said you've had a lot of leadership roles aside from the one that you're in now. What do you think your favorite probably was? You talked about high school, your sorority. What kind of- what do you think was like the most fun for you?

Catherine Mallanda: Absolutely. The most fun was I was in charge in my sorority. I was in charge of the ritual side. So what makes your sorotity your sorority and the, you know, initiating people into it and teaching them the background and what it's about. And ya know a lot of it's about being of good character. And to me, again, that relates exactly to what we're doing at school.

Catherine Mallanda: We redesigned our mission statement being a new principal. You know I've been at the school 20 years, but I felt like it was time to relook at what was our what was our mission. And it's to educate inspire and empower. And educate, obviously. But the inspire and empower parts are really important. And when I look back on it, that developing people as a as good character, empowering them to do more and inspiring them to be of good character by being a good role model myself probably started in that role.

Pria Sharma: Yeah, that's really really interesting how everything kind of is tied into this one very comprehensive position.

Catherine Mallanda: And it takes you to be almost 50 to look back and see that. At the time you have no idea.

Catherine Mallanda: But as you hit that kind of that later stage of your career being twenty five, this is my twenty fifth year in education, you know, and looking back, I'm like, oh look at all these things. Right. You don't know them maybe at the time, but in retrospect you can see how that develops.

Pria Sharma: So if you had to kind of describe your leadership style, like how would you do that? What type of leadership style do you think that you kind of take on?

Catherine Mallanda: I'm certainly servant leader. I mean, I'm one hundred percent the person that is not going to ask people to do something I'm not willing to do myself. I think you have to be able to get in the in the trenches and to know what - your your job as a leader is to make somebody else better at their job. Like, for me, my job is to be able to give the teachers the situation where they can be the best teacher they can be. My job is to give students the best opportunities to be the best, whatever they want to be whenever they figure that out. Right. That's my job. And I do that. I think by trying to be in the trenches, you know, that's kind of my my just role. You know, I like to stick me. You know, I'll sit in the lunchroom talking with kids and doing things like that. You know, I'll go help the custodians clean up on Halloween when they're I mean, doing that. And to me, that's where you show somebody like, I'm willing to do this with you. So and then also, I think to being a servant leader, but also remembering to explain "the why" because, you know, when I was a classroom teacher, your main your main concern is four walls want the best for inside those four walls. Sometimes you don't see how your four walls touch the next four walls, touch the next four walls, touch the next four walls. That's my job is to see all of them. But then to also explain to people, hey, I've made this maybe this decision. Let's say I've made a decision. I did it this way because within your four walls you're looking at this. But I have to look at this and think about how this affects everyone.

Pria Sharma: Yeah.

Catherine Mallanda: Being able to take the time to explain the why behind what you're doing, too, is super important. But you don't start in that you're there to serve others as a leader. I don't you know, to me, I couldn't do it any other way.

Pria Sharma: Yeah, that's something that we've talked about a lot in the classes, the idea of the servant leadership. So kind of going off of that. So obviously, since you're principal, you have lots of people kind of like underneath you, like all the teachers you've got, like you said, the custodial staff. You've got the faculty, you've got the guidance counselors, you've got so many people. You've got your like assistant principals, everyone

Catherine Mallanda: All the students, all their parents. We are accountable to all of those people, the parents, everyone.

Pria Sharma: So obviously it's a job that you can't just do on your own. So how do you kind of decide when you need to delegate, do you think? Obviously, I'm assuming you think delegation is very important. So how do you decide when to delegate a task versus when you can just do it on your own?

Catherine Mallanda: Not my greatest strength. I think what I've gotten better I've gotten way better at it.

Catherine Mallanda: I was, first of all, very lucky. My last role, being an assistant principal, I had a principal who was very good at letting us be in charge of our area. So if it had anything to do with curriculum section, I got to run it, you know, and there were things I would go and say, hey, I'm going to change this. What do you think? Because she had been there longer than me, but I really did get to do a lot in that respect. You were never the one that was the final word, but you got to- I got to do a lot. So I was given that opportunity. And that's one of the things that I've really tried in the three years. Being principal myself is to make sure that every administrator gets that because I got it being curriculum instruction, but not everybody got it on. The team really changed our roles as as leaders in my group in that everybody really has ownership of their little like area I've given them and they know I'm there to answer questions. And then a lot of times, instead of interceding, if there are questions or concerns, I'll let them try to handle it first so they get that opportunity, because to me, the best thing I can do is if some of my AP's become principals, then I have done my job.

Catherine Mallanda: My job is to prepare them if they want to, to do that and give opportunity to grow and be better leaders themselves. So I do that. I also feel like you've got it. It's very important when you have so many different entities, you've got to have a way to get the feel and to figure out what's going on because you can't be everywhere all the time. So we have department chairs who are leaders in the school for each curriculum area and we talk about everything. And sometimes I'll still make a decision that isn't what they want, but we'll- I'll have gotten their input. And then they're also helpful in kind of saying, hey, this is what's going on, or pushing out a message of of why we're doing something one way. We also have a governance board, which is a group because we're a charter school. We're we're a very unique charter school in that we're part of our district, the school with a tenant zone. But we have a charter which allows us flexibility from the state.

Pria Sharma: Yes.

Catherine Mallanda: Different than any other charter school, you would think.

Pria Sharma: Yes. Very nice for sure.

Catherine Mallanda: It's a good it's a good thing to have. I mean, you know, not going to lie. I get to use it because I still am part of a huge district. But there are times if the district makes a decision I don't like, I have some flexibility. But I have a charter board that they are, you know, five people. Some of them have a direct connection to the school, some do not some. And they have to have a diverse background of businesses. So a lot of them live in the Walton community. So they know our school, their kids may have graduated years ago, their kids might be coming. I always do a young alumni because I think that's a good group, so I'm accountable to them. They give me ideas about things are going on the community from their perspective, which is not being a parent or student. So I've got that group. And then we also have a PTSA and a Foundation and they have boards. And those are great ways for me to also, you know, kind of get them engaged. They have been great preparing for COVID, for example.

Pria Sharma: Yes.

Catherine Mallanda: You know, the PTA has always done a lot with wellness as his foundation. We've had we've had hand sanitizer throughout the building for ten years.

Pria Sharma: Yes.

Catherine Mallanda: They buy it. They keep it. They want to. But during this time, when we've needed more supplies and the we've ever needed PTSA has been like, you know, they've redirected finances to help us so that we can be cleaner. And foundation was like they bought more foggers. I don't know if you've ever seen a fogger, but it's this machine, but you put stuff in it and you spray it around and in thirty seconds it's spread, it's sanitized the room.

Pria Sharma: Oh, yes. I've seen those in the hotel commercials.

Catherine Mallanda: Right. So when I when you use your original question is what do you delegate. Well I think you do have to. You know, I had a mom on PTA who went out and found all the spray bottles and all the because she's in the restaurant business. She could get me hand sanitizer in order once a month that I can't get because it's hard to find.

Pria Sharma: Yep.

Catherine Mallanda: So you realize the benefits. And then there are some things that you're like, this is going to be mine and you have to prioritize what those things are. A new initiative might be mine, something that I think if there's a huge concern to me, like cultural, a cultural change, I'm going to probably hold onto that. If I'm working on a cultural change. And and, you know, you've got to witness some of that where we really we're working on balance, student balance, student- understanding, yes we want to learn at the highest level we can, but maybe doing that in the places where most interested in.

Pria Sharma: Changing the environment.

Catherine Mallanda: Changing the environment, you know. So we've done a lot of things like that. That I'm going to own.

Catherine Mallanda: I don't need to own the buses and the, you know, athletics. Lord knows the athletic director owns athletics.

Pria Sharma: Yes.

Catherine Mallanda: Now I have to oversee the budget. I'm not going to let the money part go because if something goes wrong there, we're all in trouble. Yes, but, you know, he runs it. He comes to me when there's an issue of help hire coaches. But in terms of everyday operation, I don't want to know, you know. And so you have to learn to do that. And then you are the oversight and you trust your people and you have good people. You know, they're going to come to you when they think something is going to be questionable or maybe controversial.

Catherine Mallanda: And they want to make- see if what they're thinking is what you agree with.

Catherine Mallanda: But you also have to do it in order to just get what you need in terms of like COVID supplies and and things like that. You know our foundation raises about one hundred and forty five thousand dollars per year to hire extra teachers.

Pria Sharma: Yes.

Catherine Mallanda: I couldn't go out there and campaign and get that make that money and get parents. I have to delegate that. Noq I do my part. I explain the whys. And I'm I'm there to support that endeavor. But they really run that. They run an auction. They do- you just have to do it. Sometimes it's easier to do things yourself. And yes, while you can do them yourself, they might be done better without you.

Pria Sharma: Yes.

Catherine Mallanda: And that's hard.

Pria Sharma: It'll ease a lot of the stress if you're not having to do everything. But you do have a really good team, which I'm sure is very, very helpful.

Catherine Mallanda: I do! And, you know, they are amazing. They're not only do I work with them, they are professional colleagues, but we all get along really well personally. But on top of that, other people in the district, you know, we have 116 schools in our school district.

Pria Sharma: Wow!

Catherine Mallanda: I've had people say to me, gosh, you have such a great team, you'll get along and everything goes well.

Catherine Mallanda: And I'm like, oh, yeah, I'm the best. Yes.

Pria Sharma: Yeah so.

Catherine Mallanda: It's trust.

Pria Sharma: It is. It is for sure. If you trust the people, then you can kind of be like, go do this. I trust you to get it done correctly.

Catherine Mallanda: Right. Right.

Pria Sharma: So is there anyone in your life or kind of like maybe someone that you don't know personally but who has been a really big influence for you in terms of leadership roles or who you really admire?

Catherine Mallanda: So the reason I ever even- I never thought I would be a high school principal, that was crazy. My very first principal was a very unique man and it was Mr. Williams. And that when I got there as a teacher, I actually student taught the same school I got my first job at.

Pria Sharma: Okay

Catherine Mallanda: The man lived on campus. He and his wife lived on campus.

Pria Sharma: Oh, wow!

Catherine Mallanda: Yep. He lived on the campus.

Catherine Mallanda: He knew so many kids by name. He knew what was going on in their lives. He knew us. He got took the time to get to know everybody. He went to everything.

Catherine Mallanda: But he and I'll never forget, you know, he just was such- there was nothing. I remember so many things he told me. So much advice. And I thought if I could be that kind of principal, I want to be principal, you know? And so, you know, I hope that I hope I come halfway close and I figure I'm doing a good job. But he was totally an inspiration. But then I've I've gotten to work. I've only worked for four principals in my entire career. Which is very kind of rare, probably. But I've really learned something different from each one that you build with. You know, my my first principal- it was dedication, it was caring about the people first, that the people were what mattered. My second one, he was the greatest, like, schmoozer and talker, and that political guy. Like, he could do that, you know, so I'm not good at that so I can learn from that. Second one was a brilliant man. You want to talk about developing ways to academically raise a school? I learned from that. And the third one- the fourth one. I learned loyalty to your staff and your faculty.

Pria Sharma: Yes.

Catherine Mallanda: And that that loyalty and that support of them is probably what they need the most. Teaching is hard, teaching's hard! And everybody went to school, so they all think they could do it. And so you really have to be. It's that loyalty piece and that loyalty to, to your staff. So I learned- really all of those things put together is kind of what kind of helped me shape how I want to be.

Pria Sharma: Yeah so you have really, really combined lots of different influences.

Pria Sharma: And then there was the the author that you mentioned earlier. Who was that again? I forgot his name.

Catherine Mallanda: John Maxwell.

Pria Sharma: That's right John Maxwell

Catherine Mallanda: I will never forget that he, I read a couple of his things, but really, it was he spoke to it and we were like some leadership thing for my district. We had to go to that. And that always stuck out to me. Like your strengths are your strengths. Make you be the best at your strength and then just pull those weaknesses up enough, but don't spend all your time trying to make that weakness your strength. It's never going to be. It's not in you.

Pria Sharma: So kind of going off of that- what would you say are your leadership strengths and weaknesses? I feel like we've talked about this a little bit, but.

Catherine Mallanda: You know, I would say clearly, I think I think my strength is, you know, I am a good taskmaster. I am a good problem solver. I love to take something and develop it. Give give me an idea and let's build it. Let's, let's come up with a strategic plan. And I love that like give me that, you know, and implementation. That, that's I love that stuff. I feel like I'm because- and again I'm in a unique situation- I've been at the same school for 20 years that I went to.

Pria Sharma: Yes that's right.

Catherine Mallanda: Right. So you have to say very different. I have a different connection to that school and a different love of that community that that I would sacrifice a lot for them personally because they're important to me. Don't love the schmoozing, don't love the political side. You know, I think I've gotten to the point where I can do it, but it's not my first love. Yeah. You know?

Pria Sharma: Yes.

Catherine Mallanda: Hopefully people will be like, well, she might not be the most personable human being, but, you know, she does her job well.

Pria Sharma: Yes, that's for sure. You do! And there's other people on your team who I'm sure are great at that.

Catherine Mallanda: Yeah, well, and you have to do that. Like, I have one administrator and I hired him because he is a people person. And he will go around and talk to everyone and I'm like, good, you know, he's the big talker and you need that. You know, I need that to balance me or I'm not good at that.

Catherine Mallanda: I can do the presentations. I can do the you know, the the things that are about the content. But I'm not the world's greatest, schmoozer maybe.

Pria Sharma: Yeah, so what would you say are your favorite parts of your job, like what do you think- what is the most fun part about your current position for you?

Catherine Mallanda: Just the people, just every day, I mean, even, you know, you've heard this before where you just don't know what small interaction makes a huge difference in somebody else's life. Right. It could be that somebody is having the worst day. You have no idea and just a smile, a hello, how are you doing? When you go walking up to somebody and saying something like "Hey, you know what, I saw you in class the other three periods ago. That was a great answer." That can make some of these day, that can mean a lot. So I think my favorite part of the job is just being able to be around people, be around, to inspire them to do their best at school and do their best in all the things they're trying to do. If I can do that in the least a little bit. You know, the greatest thing that ever happened is, I see a lot of my kids that I had 20 years ago when I was first teaching, my McEachern years that I taught, I'll have those kids that will still reach out to me and say things about. I had a kid the other day and on Facebook sent me a message. He just had his first child and he was like, I took her to daycare. And I was thinking about, you know, I've got to teach her how to be the kid. That's funny in class, but not too funny to get the teacher mad.

Catherine Mallanda: And that's all- I learned that in your class. Twenty five years later, because he was my first class.

Pria Sharma: Oh wow!

Catherine Mallanda: He remembers, like he was the class clown, but we had the best time and it made class so much fun.

Pria Sharma: So it's those relationships. It's being able to make a difference. And if I can do that in the least a little way, then I feel like I'm batting a thousand.

Pria Sharma: And I remember even when I was at Walton, you were always in the hallway. You were always everywhere. And it was so, it was so different from anything kind of before to like- like every day when I would walk in from the parking lot, you'd be standing there in the atrium and I was like "Hi Dr. Mallanda!"

Catherine Mallanda: Yeah, every day that's my spot!

Catherine Mallanda: You know and it's little, but if it's something that can make that can mean a lot in the end then I'm all for it.

Pria Sharma: And so what- like if you were giving advice, like a piece of advice to someone who wanted to go into leadership in education, what do you think the best piece of advice that you've received is and what piece of advice would you give to someone else?

Catherine Mallanda: Well, I think the piece of advice I would give somebody else is that you've got to make sure, especially at the high school, it is, it is an all encompassing job, right

Catherine Mallanda: It is, you know, you know, to do it well in my mind, to do it well and to do it right, you really have to be at school a lot. And you have to love being at school. You've got to want to do those things to be around the people, to spend the time, you know, I mean, is there every day that you want to go to a football game on a Friday night in the rain? Right.

Pria Sharma: Maybe not live on campus, but

Catherine Mallanda: Not live on campus, but, you know, you have to have that. You've got it. You've got to just you have to you have to be willing to say this is you know, this is what I want to do. And you have to be willing. It's it is hard. And this is one thing I tell people to it's hard because in the classroom you get a lot of positive feedback from the kids. Right. You get that piece and you kind of lose that kid connection a little. Every time you kind of go into leadership, you kind of pull away from the kids, which is what you got in for. So you have to realize those ways to be in that. So that's the little piece of advice I tell people is to, you know, make sure you're really ready to make that change because it does put you in a different role then, you know, if you got into it just because I mean, I love the kids, I love teaching, and you do have to understand that changes. But you have to look at now you're, now my kids are my teachers. Like I now consider my teachers, my kids. I'm taking care of them so they can take care of the students. So, you know, just just really understanding the job before you get into it I think is the most important part, really. And then you have to have some natural skills there to. [No how far are you going?]

Catherine Mallanda: Sorry.

Pria Sharma: No worries. And then have you received any really good pieces of advice that you can remember?

Catherine Mallanda: So, I mean, my first principal gave me so many good pieces of advice. He was definitely the "they don't care what you know until they know how much you care."

Pria Sharma: Mm hmm.

Catherine Mallanda: That was his number one thing. You can be the best. You can know more about math than anybody else. No one cares. The students, no 15 year olds in your class cares about how much you know about math.

Pria Sharma: Yes.

Catherine Mallanda: They care about that they love you. And that's what education I mean, that's an education thing, but I actually think that's anything, you know, I mean, the people that work for you, I would think that's the same in business or anything else. They're part of that. You want to work for somebody you're proud to work for, that you feel is an excellent leader. Right. And so I think he gave a lot of good advice about about that side of it that I think I think made a lot of sense and made me realize that, you know, obviously I didn't want to go into engineering because I was worried about not having that personal social interaction. Well, he showed us how that is what the job was about. And that is it's about, you know, if you're a servant leader, you're there to serve. You're there to to take care of people.

Pria Sharma: Yep. For sure. So this is kind of like a big question, so if you don't really have a concrete answer, that's OK. But do you have an idea of kind of what you want your legacy to be. More specific, like your legacy at Walton as a principal? Do you kind of have an idea of what you want that to be?

Catherine Mallanda: You know, I, I you know, we talked a little bit about the culture. You know, my personal opinion was when I came in, we had the academics, we had very successful athletics.

Catherine Mallanda: We have very driven kids. We have very driven families. I wanted to make it a happier place. And hate to use the word "happy" because it seems mundane, but, you know, you should go to school every day. Hey, is it fun to take tests? No. But you should come and feel supported, You should come and feel like people care about me. You should come and know you have a safe place.

Pria Sharma: Yes.

Catherine Mallanda: Those things. Then you know the hard parts, you can still be happy. So that's kind of what I want to do. I want to I want to know that when I walked out the door, I left it better than I found it. I don't think I probably could have left it better academically, to be honest with you. That was going to be really hard. But I think my personality is that caring piece. And if I can bring it and make it a more caring, a more inclusive place, then I'll have done a good job. And I think, you know, if somebody can in twenty five years down the road can speak about me the way I can talk about my first principal that I'll have done the job.

Pria Sharma: I definitely, even in just the two years that I was there that you were principal, I definitely saw a big shift and obviously the academics at the school stayed great. And you're right, they could they probably could not have got up.

Catherine Mallanda: Yeah.

Pria Sharma: Unless all we did was study all the time. But definitely I definitely saw shifts in like you said, the culture of the school to be just more joyful, I guess would be the word that I would use.

Catherine Mallanda: Yeah, yeah.

Pria Sharma: And then just one last question. Kind of do you like what do you think leadership means to you? Like kind of in a- like you obviously have degrees in leadership, certifications in leadership. Kind of. What do you think it means to you?

Catherine Mallanda: I mean, leadership means to me taking on the responsibility to bring, to help others be the best they can be at their job and to bring that to something. And to to take to take care, to elevate, to empower the again, it comes back to kind of like the mission statement of the whole school. You know, to empower others to be the best they can be. That's my job. You know, I'm not going to go in there and be a rock star English teacher, but I can empower somebody else to be a rock star English teacher and therefore their kids to be really successful in that area. I can't do it myself, but I can empower others to do it. So I think as a leader, your job is to empower others to reach their goals and to reach their, you know, highest, highest, whatever they want to do. I mean, that's just it's about empowering others as a leader.

Pria Sharma: Yep.

Catherine Mallanda: I think.

Pria Sharma: That's, well, thank you so much if you- unless you have anything else last words?

Catherine Mallanda: No I don't think so!

Pria Sharma: Thank you so much!

Catherine Mallanda: Thank you. You know I love- I love talking about school and it's probably my favorite thing. And I'm happy to get to talk to somebody who went there and got to experience it and kind of see it through those eyes. And hopefully, if you like I said, I think a lot of the things that we do in leadership, it's not really clear what place you're doing it in. It's about the people and how you take care of them. And that, just like you said, globally, global leadership's your major, I don't care if you're, you know, the principal, the president, you know, you've got a job and a CEO. I think it's all kind of the same.

Catherine Mallanda: So hopefully this will help somebody somewhere.

Pria Sharma: Yes, I'm sure it will. Well, thank you so much.

Catherine Mallanda: You're welcome