Interview of Rosie Guixens

Interview with Rosa “Rosie” Guixens

Current Chief of Police for Riverdale, Maryland; Former Police Captain of Prince George’s County, Maryland

Mia: To start off, can you tell me a little bit about yourself and your background and how that led to your position as chief of police at Riverdale?

Rosie: So my background… I guess I’ll start with college. I went to University of Maryland, graduated from there with my bachelor’s degree in criminal justice and back then, there were, I knew at that point my plan had been to be hired by a police department and then I was going to get a couple years under my belt while I got my Master's Degree and then go Federal. That was my original plan because I really wanted to be like Clarice Starling from Silence of the Lambs. I thought that was the coolest job in the world, tracking serial killers. Anyway, that ended up obviously not happening because when I got hired or recruited by Prince George’s County, back then, a Hispanic female with a college degree was an anomaly, so you didn't have a lot of females, you certainly didn't have a lot of Hispanic females, and you had none with a college degree. I had quite a few people, quite a few agencies that were recruiting me, to include Montogomery County and other surrounding jurisdictions, but at the time Prince George's County had the best retirement. They were paying better and it was busy, and I wanted to be busy. I wanted you know, a higher crime area. I guess that doesn't sound good in an interview, but that's kind of what I was looking for. Anyway, so, yeah, I got hired by PG County, graduated from the Academy in February, or I’m sorry September of ‘94, 1994, and off I went. I forget the second part of the question.

Mia: Oh just like how this led to your current or like your leadership position as chief of Riverdale or just like that?

Rosie: Yeah, so as I went through my career with PG County. I did, you know, a variety of different things. Most of it was in patrol, but I was in canine for quite a while, and then after I got out of canine I just, that's when I realized, okay, I need to move on in my career and start getting promoted. I started climbing through the ranks, and when I retired from PG County, I retired as a major, the commander of District 1, which is the highest district. I had about 200 people under me at that point, officers and civilians, and when I retired, I had been offered a position. I applied as the assistant chief of Riverdale Park, and since then, when I got the job of assistant chief during my time there the chief retired, so I applied to be the chief and got that job, and yeah. That’s how… I mean nothing really. I didn’t really set out to be chief. It was just, I think something that happened when I started getting promoted in the county police it was more of a financial thing because I knew I wanted to have a better retirement, more lucrative I guess. You know, I had kids at that point and it was time to think like, I’m going to be paying for private school and paying for college and so I need to get paid a little bit more money, so that weighed in. Plus, I thought it was cool when I always had pretty good positions as I started getting promoted. I was a sergeant. I was in patrol and then lieutenant I was in charge of the recruiting and background division which was neat. It was, you know… hiring people was… recruiting and hiring people was a good experience. Then I worked as captain and then major at the Hyatsville District.

Mia: Nice! Well, you kind of touched on this but can you tell me about your first promotion or leadership position and looking back how that went for you, and is there anything you would do differently?

Rosie: So my first official leadership position was as a sergeant when I got promoted to sergeant. Prior to that, I guess I was kind of considered the unofficial leader because I was the senior corporal on the squad and you did a lot of stuff to help the sergeant and run, you know help him or her run the squad. I always had males. Actually. I don't think I've ever had a female supervisor, ever. It's kind of funny. I just thought about that. Anyway, but then when I got promoted to sergeant, I got transferred to a different District, which was District 3 at the time, and Henry Sector which is a very high crime area and we were just busy, busy, busy, running from call, to call, to call, and I got, I was very fortunate because I essentially was able, like I mentioned in that video, I kind of built my own squad which was super cool. That was probably, other than Canine, That was my most memorable time on the department, because I really had a great Squad. We worked super well together and we're still, like I said before very close, to this day.

Mia: Is there anything you would do differently?

Rosie: Oh yeah, that was the other part. No, I don't think there is anything I would do differently. You know, I've always been able to supervise my people and still be friends, but you have to be able to separate, you know, work life and personal friendship and I've always been able to do that. I've been fortunate to do that and I also been fortunate to have friends that are able to do the same thing, so it makes it a little bit easier. No, I don’t think I would do anything differently. I mean when I look back at my career, I have been unbelievably fortunate in all my experiences. I mean I’ve had good and bad, don’t get me wrong, but the all bad ones I’ve learned from, and so I don't, I don't really regret anything. I guess that's what I'm trying to say is I look back and I don't have any regrets so I'm not really sure all along if there’s anything I would have done differently.

Mia: Perfect. What cultural identities or experiences are most important to you or have impacted you the most?

Rosie: What do you mean? Okay, so let me say this because I’m not really sure if this is what you mean or not, but I’m a Hispanic female. That’s what I’m considered. That’s what I’m down as but I don't necessarily like go out and tell people. I've gone through my entire career and some people don't know that I speak Spanish. Does that make sense?

Mia: No, that does, definitely.

Rosie: Okay, because I don’t carry my, I don’t go out here and say, “Well, I’m a Hispanic female I can…” You know, I don't do that. I am who I am because I worked hard and I worked hard and played hard. I earned everything that I got or achieved, but not necessarily because of being a Hispanic female, because like I said, when people… Sometimes I would start blurting out Spanish on the street, and people would look at me like “Holy crap, she speaks Spanish and I’ve known her for, you know, the past five years.” So some people just don’t know and just because my first name is Rosa, people don’t, you don’t assume because a lot of people that have, you know Spanish names never learned to speak. They just happen to have Hispanic parents or somehow you know got a Spanish name. Yeah, so does that answer your question or am I misinterpreting it?

Mia: No, I think that does. That definitely does. Thanks. What experiences have shaped you as a leader?

Rosie: Having other good role models, as I came up on the department, good and bad, because like I said before, when you have bad supervisors you need to learn from them and what not to do. Some people don’t really do that, but that’s another story. I’ve had a lot of good ones, and you know, women and men. Like I’ve said, I’ve never really had a direct female supervisor, like I’m trying to, because I’ve never really been asked that question before, but I don’t think I’ve ever had a direct supervisor that was a woman. I’ve had subordinates obviously that are female, but not superiors, and remember, it is different than working in a police department, which is considered a paramilitary organization than working in the corporate world when it comes to a lot of this stuff. There’s a, you know, a chain of command and all that doesn’t necessarily exist outside. To answer your question, I think it’s having had good mentors, male and female, mostly male, really, because when I mean, when I came on, there were very few females on the department. Yeah, I think that’s it and learning from mistakes, you’ve got to take… You’ve got to always walk away, I mean you’re going to make mistakes along the way, but as long as you learn from them, I think, and you learn not to do them again, that’s where you grow, and that shapes you either, as a future leader or if you decide not to be a leader or not to be, you know, move on and get promoted it still helps you in your career. Does that make sense?

Mia: Yeah, it does. Yeah, I think you touched on this a bit earlier, but like were you called into leadership, or did you seek it, or were you more seeking it based on personal convictions or like values?

Rosie: I think a combination of personal convictions. I wanted to get promoted I wanted, I wasn't seeking like power and prestige or whatever, but I was, as I went along down the road of, you know, my career, I realized that, and that's because I had good people with me, my team, that supported me and kind of pushed me down the road to get promoted and every rank is competitive. Within Prince George’s County, every rank is competitive, meaning you compete against each other to get promoted, except for anything after Captain. Beyond that it's appointed so once I got promoted to Captain, I knew that's where the road ended I could have just stayed at Captain, but then I was appointed to Major, and then I retired after that because the next step would have been Deputy Chief. Yeah, I think it was a combination of personal conviction and also, like I said before, looking at my retirement down the road and knowing that I had a family and, you know, tuition to pay, and just, you know, trying to get a better sense of lifestyle and stuff like that, so that was also a motivator financially.

Mia: Have you learned from obstacles, or how have you learned from obstacles or challenges that you have faced?

Rosie: I think I’ve learned to pick and choose my battles a little bit smarter. I used to… People will, it's kind of like a joke on my department now and with the County Police, is that no one ever told me no, and typically no one ever told me no because I would fight, and fight, and fight until I got what I wanted. whatever told me no because I would fight and fight and fight until I got what I wanted, but I feel like I have gotten better at picking and choosing my battles, smarter at that. Like the video that I did, I was going to fight that because I hate that kind of stuff. I don't like attention and I don't like being the, you know, the focus but I was told “Do not pick this as a battle because you're going to lose so just do it. Just shut up and do it.” so I’m like “Okay, fine.” Yeah, I guess it’s kind of a weak answer, but that’s probably… Repeat the question. I’m sorry.

Mia: No you’re good. How have you learned from obstacles or the challenges you have faced?

Rosie: Yeah, I think the first one is picking and choosing my battles.

Mia: What does leadership mean for you?

Rosie: Leadership means taking care of your people. Leadership means grooming your people to be future leaders and thinking about others. Knowing that being able to… Being a leader is knowing that when you step out of that position, is knowing that the people you have, and when I say groomed, do you know what I mean when I say that?

Mia: Yeah, like preparing kind of?

Rosie: Preparing, yes, that whoever I have brought up is going to step into my role, and everyone's going to, you know, you're still going to have that time, that period of transition, and everything else, and you're going to make mistakes, but they're going to be prepared. I think that's what's key in leadership is preparing your people to take, to take over and also taking care of them. It’s not all about you. You’ve got a lot of people who that promoted, and seek this, but it’s all about them. It’s all about ego, and you know, banging their chest and say “Look what I did. Look what I can do.” I don’t like that. That’s not my style at all.

Mia: Well, you kind of just mentioned this just now, but how would you characterize your leadership style?

Rosie: I would characterize it as a combination, and we had to study leadership styles, so if I say a term that doesn’t make sense or whatever let me know, but probably a servant type of leadership and then combined with participative, I can never say that word right, because I touched on the grooming and the mentoring which is the servant style and getting you know, preparing your people. You know, leaving behind strong leaders when you move on and then participative because I share responsibilities. I’m big on team building, big on making this a team effort. Not to place blame anywhere, because as the leader you’re always going to be the one held responsible, you know whether it’s good or bad, but I looked to my subordinates for ideas and if they have questions. I am very much an open-door type of person, so I… There’s a there is a rank structure when it comes to discipline and things like that, but as far as people coming and if they have a question or if they have an idea I totally have an open-door policy. To go back as far as leadership style, I would say combination of servant, and participative and does that, do you need me to tell you what those are again or are you good with that?

Mia: I mean, you could elaborate on them a little bit more if you want to.

Rosie: So, yeah, the serving, like I said before is just grooming and building your people. Mentoring them and knowing that you’re leaving behind strong, those that want to be because you’ve got people who go through their whole career as a corporal and there’s absolutely nothing wrong with that. It’s all what you’re driven to do and they remain the unofficial leaders and they’ll always be and that’s great, but if that person had to step in in an emergency or for any other reason, they could. They’re more than capable of it because you’ve prepared them for that. Again, sharing, and having an open door, and asking people, “What do you think?” “What are your ideas?” and you know just being a team. Just because I’m the boss doesn’t mean it’s my way or the highway. I don’t operate like that at all. Yeah, I guess that’s it.

Mia: Yeah, that’s great. Thank you. What are your professional strengths and weaknesses?

Rosie: Professional strengths, I’m very direct, and some people don’t necessarily see that as a strength. I think it took a while for my current boss, who’s the town manager to get used to that. If you asked me a question, I’m going to give you an answer and it’s going to be about as direct as it can be, still professional, but it’s direct. I don’t have a lot of fluff. I don’t like fluff. Fluff, to me is fake, so I always tell people, “Don’t ask me a question you’re not ready to hear the answer to, because you know that whatever is going to come out of my mouth is how I really feel.” A lot of people appreciate that. That’s why I’m told, “Everybody loves you because everybody knows you’re just going to say how it is, and there’s not a lot of BS that goes along with that,” because especially, now in the touchy-feely world that we live in everybody’s throwing around a lot of fluff and it doesn’t mean anything to anybody because its fake. I can’t do that. I have no poker face, so that’s another reason why I hate this Zoom world because everything is like Bam, right there. I’ve been told to fix my face on several occasions. Weaknesses is I’m very type A, so if I don’t know you and I don't necessarily trust you I’m not going to delegate until I’m comfortable, that I know that you’re going to be able to handle whatever I’m going to give you to do. Delegation can be sometimes a weakness for me, and I have to make myself delegate. Once I start feeling overwhelmed, I’m like I need to shuffle some of this stuff and farm it out to people that I know can handle it, but if I don’t, if I’m in a position where I don’t know that that person’s capable of whatever I’m about to give them, I’ll just say it’s easier to do it myself, than have to go back and do it all over again Does that make sense? So I’d probably say that’s the weakness. I’m sure I can think of more, but yeah, and I don’t get political. That’s the other thing that I think some people appreciate is trying to not go down that road because it’s too polarizing, right?

Mia: Yeah, definitely. In general, What or who has been your greatest influence, but like also in your 30 years of law enforcement, is there a leader or a mentor that stands out to you there as well?

Rosie: They’ve all been long and retired because anybody that I would say would be that person was with the county police. Yeah, they’ve been long and retired. I said it before, I’ve always been very fortunate, both men and women, to have good mentors and good people bringing me up on the department, as we call it raising me, that I don’t know if they saw something in me or they saw that I cared and I was very happy to take charge and happy to take the initiative because I knew what needed to be done and I would just step in and wouldn’t wait to necessarily be told, “Hey, go do…” I mean unless I was a rookie, but you know, “Go do this.” I would just step in because I knew it had to be done. I was always fortunate. I can’t really pick out one particular… that I could give that credit to because I really had a handful of people.

Mia: Okay, so leaders help to turn ideas into action and empower others. How do you accomplish this?

Rosie: Okay, and then there’s, you have to give that person, whoever came to you with this idea and you empower them to take action and do what it is that they need to do to get this idea through. You have to give them credit for that too because you’ve got people that… They came to you because they knew they had faith that you were going to listen to them and you were going to take their idea and you were going to run with it but I'm not running with it I'm empowering them to run with it and they get the credit for that. Sometimes they'll fall on their face because it might turn into you know a flop, or whatever but they're still going to get the credit: A. for coming with an idea and caring enough to have the initiative to come and say, “Look how about, what if we try this?” and sometimes it works. Sometimes it doesn’t work because the came to you What if we try this and sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn’t work but you’ve got to try, unless it’s a really bad idea from the get-go. Obviously, I have to believe that it has potential to be a good idea. They’ve got to get the credit for it. Right, like you can’t, no one’s going to come to you if they think you’re going to steal their thunder. That’s not okay. Does that kind of answer your question?

Mia: No, it does. You mentioned earlier about like having, I guess bad supervisors, I think or like certain situations like that… because I know we like kind of talked about earlier about how having bad supervisors can help you become a better leader and learning what not to do or whatever.

Rosie: Absolutely.

Mia: Yeah, have you had any experiences like this that have helped you become a better leader?

Rosie: Yeah, it’s, I’ve had quite a few do as I say, not as I do type of leaders that lead from the back, and not the front. That’s one thing I always go back to in leadership style. I’ve always led from the front. I'm not going to ask you to go do something that I'm not willing to do myself. That's just not a good leader. You and that's how you get people to follow when they know you have their back and I know my guys have my back like this is a team. We're all in this together. I will ultimately be the one responsible when things go bad or good, but this is, you know we’re here, we’re in this together type of thing. I’ve had supervisors, mostly as a corporal. No, actually no when I was a sergeant I had some bad lieutenants, too. Like I said, do as I say, not as I do, and it’s just really bad, and I’ve had, you know… I’ve been fortunate to not have this happen very often, but it was early on in my career where I was told, you know, women don’t belong in police work, straighout, and I was like, “Okay, have a great day. Bye-bye.” That was my supervisor, and I don’t know. I don’t even remember what it was about. He was asking me like I don’t know, “Go make me a cup of coffee.” kind of thing. Remember this is back in the mid-'90s, and you know, it was completely different back then in that sense that you got away with saying and I’m not a complaint maker unless it’s something seriously wrong. I never said anything to anybody or did anything, not that anything would have happened because back then, it would have been like, “Okay, we’ll talk to him.” and that would have been the end of it. I’ve been very fortunate to not have had to deal with a lot of that stuff, that mentality. I don’t know how I got on that subject.

Mia: About supervisors…

Rosie: See, I’m rambling.

Mia: You’re good.

Rosie: Yes, but the bad supervisors, I mean the key with having bad supervisors, and I tell, I tell my guys that are still with the police now, and have a bad supervisor that, “Take what you really dislike and learn from it and know that’s you’re not going to be that person.” You're not going to be that type of leader because you see the damage it does, you see how it hurts the, you know, the squad, the camaraderie that goes on, everything, even sometimes it affects safety, officer safety. Yeah, you just have to remember there’s going to be good and bad, and when you have the bad, you’ve got to learn from it.

Mia: I think you kind of touched on this earlier when we were talking about your weaknesses and stuff, but like about delegation. Do you feel it’s important to delegate, and if so, why? How and when do you do it?

Rosie: I think it’s important to delegate because you can’t do everything yourself. Things are eventually going to fall through the crack. There’s no way. This is not a one-man job. You need help. You can not do this by yourself, especially at certain levels, at any level, you can’t do it by yourself, and in delegating, you’re teaching, and you’re grooming. You’re mentoring your subordinates because they're learning how to do the same job. You know, you delegate little by little, and then you incrementally increase the, not difficulty but the I guess intensity of whatever it is you’re delegating. There’s so many things that can be delegated and so many levels of work. It’s kind of unless, so I don’t… I can’t answer when. If that makes sense? Like I’ll get things that come in, you know Rob is my deputy chief. I don’t even need to say it to him because it won’t even make it to my desk because he’ll intercept it, take it, and get it done. That’s somebody taking the initiative because, he knows it needs to get done and I know I’ll get a sticky on my desk, “I’ve handled it. I already took care of this.” I’m like, “Sweet, it’s gone.” I don’t know… There’s no specific time that anything goes off in my head that says, “Delegate this.” It just, it just sort of happens. It just depends, and sometimes in delegating, it’s a task like stats, let’s say. Stats are due at the end of the month. As a sergeant, you have to turn in stats for your squad at the end of the month, every month, by a certain date. That is delegated to somebody, and that person I expect, I’m not going to remind them every month, “This is your job. This is what you have to do. Ultimately, if it doesn’t get done, it’s going to be a reflection on me and that person, but mostly me and then you handle it, and however it gets handled. Obviously, you’re going to be delegating to somebody else, or you’re going to end up doing it yourself, but that’s never happened to me… typically. Nobody wants to hear my mouth if they don’t get something done that I’ve asked them to do.

Mia: How do you measure your success, and how do you learn from failure?

Rosie: I don’t know how to measure success. I think because I can look back on my career, I’m proud of what I have done. I’m proud of my career and I can walk away and say I have no regrets. I guess that's how to can to try to tie that up without going off on a tangent as far as measuring success. When I retire, I retire with my head held high. Looking back on a really, I was very, very, fortunate, along the way, so I would say that’s success. There’s a lot, you know, a lot of people that can’t do that, or you know… Now I’m starting to ramble, so I’m going to stop with that. What was the second question? How do you learn from your failures?

Mia: Uh-huh.

Rosie: I mean, I don’t know how you don’t learn from your failures. I don’t even know how to answer that because you have to be willing to take a chance. You have to be willing to try something different, but if it works, it works. If it doesn’t, you don’t try it again, you don’t do it again. You do it in a different way, but I don’t know how to not learn from my mistakes. I’m not going to get burned twice if that’s what you mean. You know that saying, “Burn me once, shame on you. Burn me twice shame on me.” or whatever?

Mia: Yeah.

Rosie: You’re not going to burn me twice, because I am going to learn from, and I’ve made some mistakes, so when I say no regrets doesn’t mean I haven’t made mistakes because I have, but I’ve learned from them.

Mia: Nice. What are two or three steps of action you believe are essential to enable others to be successful?

Rosie: I don’t know. Repeat the question again, please.

Mia: What are two or three steps of action you believe are essential to enable others to be successful?

Rosie: I think empowering people to make decisions and also letting them know that it’s okay to be approachable and come to you with an idea or come to you with a problem and maybe that’s not empowering, necessarily. The decision making, yes. I think them knowing, and by them I mean subordinates, that they can come to you with pretty much anything and you either tell them to “Get the hell out. You’re crazy.” or “Okay, let’s talk about this a little bit more.” It just depends, because there’s just so many. It runs the gamut. That question’s very broad, so it’s hard, but I think empowering others is, would be the easiest answer, to make decisions and again making them feel comfortable enough to come to you.

Mia: What advice do you have for building relationships and trust in your department?

Rosie: I think that goes back to the whole open door policy, being direct, not having a lot of fluff, being human, not being, you know this robotic person that people don’t feel comfortable coming to. As the chief, a female chief, it can, you know, you carry that whatever… I think I’m more approachable than a male chief would be just because I’m a female. It makes it a little bit easier for these guys, and when I say guys I mean men because I only have one other female, to approach me, just because of my sex. I am more approachable in nature just because of who I am, or what I am I guess I should say.

Mia: Nice, this is the last question, so what do you want your legacy to be?

Rosie: That I’ve left behind strong leaders that are able to step in when I leave. I’ve said this before, because you know what really gets to me is when I see… I hate to be sexist in this because it can apply to boys to, but you know when you think of a police officer, you typically think of a man. When I see these little girls, we have an elementary school right across the street, so we’re always doing stuff with the kids. These little girls just look at me with these eyes like “Look at her.” You know letting them know that they can accomplish anything they want, that they set their mind to, and don’t let anybody tell you you can’t do something. I guess that’s what I would like to leave behind.

Mia: No, that’s great. Thanks so much. For taking the time to do this.